Erica 0:41

Love and last part to today on the show. welcome to the life free of anxiety podcast, where each week we'll bring you another discussion to help you on your way to overcoming your fears. I'm Erica and together with dr. Charles Barr, a licensed clinical psychologist, specializing in anxiety. We'll be your guides on this journey to find a list of helpful free resources we offer head to lifefreeofanxiety.com Because you are not broken, you are not alone. And you are on your way to living a life free of anxiety. Well, hi, Merry Christmas and happy holidays. It's great to be with you a quick warning. We will not be with you next week. We are moving in my house. We are moving around Christmas and that is a lot, and we're going to change, take the change programs, advice, and we're not going to wear ourselves out, trying to put up a show next week. So we're going to actually be back with you next year. Um, but this is our last episode of the year, and it's a great episode because it deals with loss, which is always so hard around the holidays. I was hearing today that the holidays are the loneliest time of the year. So while all the buildup around us says, it's the happiest, it's actually not. It's the opposite. So we do want to end with, um, this episode with my friend, Gina and talking about the loss of her wonderful husband, Frank, um, if you haven't heard part one, make sure you go back and listen to that. And also we have a good episode of a couple of weeks ago about why we feel everybody is under stress right now. So we'd love for you to hear that. Um, also you can still buy the change program. You can give somebody the gift of the change program. Um, there's still time. You can get that for a Christmas present, even because you went, when you buy it, you basically just have online access. So there's nothing. There's no such thing as a late Christmas gift here. You'd just have to say, Hey, I bought this for you and you can log in now, but I'm guessing my guess is you've listened to this show because you deal with anxiety and we really, really want you to walk into the new year with more purpose and tools. Really effective tools to deal and combating anxiety for the rest of your life. I'm not going to get too into it, but it is a 16 week program. You can do it from home. You can do it from anywhere. If you have any questions, you can reach out to me, but look into doing the program because it's something that Dr. Barra and I both did when we were dealing with anxiety. And we really, truly believe it can help you. So check into that for your new year's resolution, getting better control over your anxiety. I'm serious. This is the best gift you can give to yourself. And that's changed with two A's dot com. change.com. You can also reach out to me@ericaatlifefreeofanxiety.com. Okay, well, I want to get to the show. I want to wish you a very Merry Christmas happy holidays. Thank you for sticking with us this year. You were with us, some of you at the beginning of the pandemic, when we didn't even know what it was, how you caught it, and we wanted to calm you down with all the information we did know. Well, now we know more information and we just pray and hope that you have a safe and very happy new year. And of course, a much brighter and better 2021. But from Dr. Barbara and I, we both really thank you for being here. And we are thinking about you this holiday season. So now let's listen to my friend, Gina. Who's not only dealt with the love and loss of her husband, but also recreating an entire new life for herself and how she's gotten through the loss.

Gina Pastore 4:12

So during this time he's pitching. In Dodgers stadium and he's pitching against Fernando valance Rayleigh, and he throws one of his fast balls to a guy named Steve Sachs. Steve Sachs hits it and it hits Frank in the elbow. It was actually the, the ball was actually headed for Frank's face. So he did what anybody does. He put his arm up to block his face and it hit him right in the elbow, which caused it, didn't break his elbow, but it caused bone chips to dislodge and, his elbow to swell and all that. It was a very, very bad injury. And as a pitcher, you don't want to injure your pitching arm, you know, So he is, starts to go through a crisis, like, Oh my gosh, what am I going to do with my life? If I'm not a baseball player. So at that point, the guys, he had been hanging around these, these Jesus freaks, these Bible thumpers, they're there for him. They're loving on him, they're praying for him. And that really, um, That really influenced him like, wow, these guys are the real deal. They're the ones who are really here for me at this time, but he still had these questions. He was like, I really want to believe this. And I do go to church and chapel, but I just need more. So thankfully they went to the chapel leader whom we didn't know at the time was the number two man with athletes in action, which is a division of campus crusade for Christ and Wendell is somewhat schooled in what's called apologetics and giving reasons for faith. So he knows how to kind of deal with. You know, Frank's questions and he gives Frank three books. He knows that Frank reads. So he's like, I want you to read these books and refute them. One of the books was the evidence demands, a verdict by Josh McDowell. And Frank, there was no refuting it. The evidence was crystal clear. So if anybody's listening to this podcast and you're feeling the same way my husband did, I just want you to know there are answers out there and the evidence demands a verdict has been revised. Um, it used to be a lot like an encyclopedia, but it is so good, Erica, but anyways, Frank came to chapter seven, which is entitled liar, lunatic, or Lord. And those are really the only three options for Jesus that has, and I'm not talking about a mythical Jesus that people made up. I'm talking about a historical man who walked the earth. And there's so much evidence of that. And this historical man was either a liar, a lunatic, or he was who he said he was. So Frank on chapter seven was reading this in the bathroom at, uh, they were playing the Pittsburgh pirates at the time. And Frank gave himself to the Lord just. Totally did a transformation, but I have to tell you, Erica, I was not thrilled about it. I was freaked out like, Oh my gosh, you have become one of those Jesus freaks.

Erica 7:40

And that's understandable to see somebody you're married to like somebody like Frank, especially just in this major league baseball player, make this huge personality switch. I mean, even for anybody in anybody who has a friend like that, I mean, that would be weird.

Gina Pastore 7:54

I know.

Erica 7:55

to me.

Gina Pastore 7:57

And it is, it does seem weird. And I know there's a lot of people that think, yeah, I'm just not into that, but I'm going to tell you what I'm going to challenge you to think about it a little differently. We hear a human being and you have a soul. And what do you do for your soul? So many of us do very little. And I know you guys talk about anxiety a lot on this podcast. I'm going to argue that so much of our anxiety is well, there's a whole bunch of reasons for it, and I'm now a counselor, so I don't mean to over spiritualize anything, but yeah. We do very little for our soul. We spend so much time on our outward appearance and how we look, he, he didn't create mandates to keep us enslaved. He did it to make us free. And so it's all been so twisted over the generations. So anyways,

Erica 8:52

and that's kind of what, I mean, that's definitely what pulled you through losing Frank. I

Gina Pastore 8:58

Oh, Erica, if I didn't, if I didn't have God in my life, I can't tell you where I'd be today. I, I can't even go there. Um,

Erica 9:09

you know, I mean, really, it was just like, how is she going to be? Is she going to be okay? And it was probably because I didn't know if I were in your position if I would be okay. So that was

Gina Pastore 9:19

right, right,

Erica 9:20

Right. And, but, um, seeing you so strong right after was remarkable. And I don't think anyone realizes like you were, Oh, I mean, of course you were devastated and you grieved, but I never saw you lose hope. I never saw anything about you that said. I'm giving up. I can't do this. I can't handle another day. It was always just like I'm taking a day at a time. I can't wait till this is, you know, moved the it's a later date. I remember you saying I can't wait till I've moved past the date of him dying more and more

Gina Pastore 9:53

Oh, I have so much. I want to say about that, because again, I know you guys focusing on, on anxiety on this podcast. Um, it is so important to grieve properly. But that's what we don't want to do in our society. We don't crying is a sign of weakness and, you know, going, if you're depressed, going through a hard time, that's a sign of weakness. And actually that's part of the problem. We don't allow ourselves to really deal with things. So I learned as soon as. You know, Frank's accident happened. Of course I was devastated. And you were with me through all that you remember, but I went to camp, I went back to counseling. I had gone to counseling earlier in my life for not any big reason. I just, if you read my book, I kind of go into it. Frank had gone to counseling when he went through a ministry burnout, and I saw that. How much it helped him. And I thought, you know, I'm going to go just to work out. I, I dealt with all my childhood stuff and all that. And I went to a really good Christian counselor and I really stress. You've got to find a good counselor because there are people that are not good and they won't lead you into a place of health. But if you find a good one, it's a really good process to go through. But anyways, so after Frank. Was in the accident and passed away. I thought, okay, I'm going back to counseling. And she helped me so much to just walk me through my grief. There were times when I went to my counseling session and I literally just sat there and cried. And very said very little the whole hour, but you know what? That's okay. It's just really important to go through it and not stuff it, cause that's what we want to do. We want to shove it down. We want to turn to maybe alcohol turn to other vices. Some people turn to eating, um, and they never deal with it. And I personally believe a lot of people carry a lot of anxiety because they've never grieved things in their life.

Erica 11:58

The past seven years of your life looking so different, I'm sure not everything has gone back to normal for you or anything like

Gina Pastore 12:07

no, um, except accepting. Accepting change is very hard and I'm not a person that ever liked a lot of change, but I have learned in watching and in God walking me through the greatest, most painful thing in my life, losing my spouse. After 35 years of marriage, I have learned now to really trust God. And so we're going through a major pandemic right now, um, 11 months ago. And they announced this lockdown and I, I know a lot of the listeners are going to relate. We were all like, what. What we're going to be locked out. I live alone and I just told you, I am an introvert. Thank goodness, but I'm also social. So I was like, what? I'm going to be locked down by myself, in my house for who knows how long this was terrifying, I had the bag drop of knowing God, you walked me through the greatest time, hardest time of my life. You can walk me through this. So the more we rely on God, the more he meets us. And the more we grow as a human being, it's a wonderful

Erica 13:25

Somebody who doesn't know what that even means. Relying on God. What would you say that looks like.

Gina Pastore 13:31

Oh, boy. Um, without getting too religious sounding here, one of the things I love to do is go out and take walks. I live in a pretty area. We have a gorgeous view of the mountains. And that ministers to me, that ministers to my soul, that's good for me. It's good to exercise. And that gives me time to think and talk to God and, you know, tell God what's going on in my life. Sometimes I'm, I'm venting. Sometimes I'm asking him for things and sometimes I'm just listening to him. That's very important. Also plugging into church, a Christian Church. We live in a culture now where, especially with the pandemic. Now it's hard to go to church, but they're all over the internet. So there's no reason not to plug in, but. Listening to God's manual, which is the Bible, um, ministers to us. After Frank died, I started listening to K KLA and Christian radio. And it ministered to me all day. So those are ways that you can kind of get closer to God because in order to get close to someone, you have to know who they are and what they're about. And so God's the same way you have to seek out no one him does that kind of

Erica 14:54

Yeah. I definitely think that helps. I think right now with the pandemic, there's, you know, social, social isolation adds to grief.

Gina Pastore 15:04

Oh, yeah.

Erica 15:04

and we've got, you know, people can't even go into a church, especially if you're in California, a lot of churches are shut down and, um, you know, there's just, so their life looks so different. And to have grief on top of that right now, I think it's a lot of, it's a lot. It's a lot of stress and it's. I, I just am so glad that you were not able to experience what you did, but that you're able to walk through this with such strength for other people to see that there's hope. Cause I think there's probably a lot of people listening right now who aren't sure that there's hope,

Gina Pastore 15:42

Right.

Erica 15:43

have dealt with maybe not even being able to be with a loved one when they passed away because of COVID or. Not being able to fly in and see each other and hug each other or do Memorial services, you know, say goodbye properly, even,

Gina Pastore 15:58

All right. I know we are living in such a, an odd time and my heart goes out. I hear stories every day about family members losing someone. They weren't able to be with them. And yeah, we're w I mean, I don't have magic answers to that, but I do know that it's important to have relationships in our life. And many of us are isolated right now. Um, I am experiencing a really neat thing. I live in Franklin. I bought a home several years ago. Our son was a baby. When we bought the house, my son is now 40. So I've lived here 40 years. And over the years we've had wonderful neighbors and everything. But during this. COVID era, my neighbors and I have gotten so close and we've watched out for each other. And last night we all went outside. It was a nice day and we brought our chairs, we social distance, but we were all outside together and we do that regularly. So in some ways it's bringing us back to those old fashioned values that are so important and so necessary and so healthy.

Erica 17:16

Yeah, definitely. And, and how are you spending the holidays? Are you able to see anyone or, I mean, is it still really rough for you? Seven years later when you have to get ready for Thanksgiving, that's Frank's not a part of.

Gina Pastore 17:34

right? Yeah. It, this year has been hard because, um, I have an elderly mother who lives on her own. Um, my sister, my brothers and sister, and I, we decided that, um, we would all, of course help her out with food and all that. Thanksgiving was very different this year. Um, yeah. I actually, uh, did spend part of the day with my mom and I spent part of the day with, uh, a family friend at a very small gathering and Christmas is going to be just very small gathering this year. So it's going to be very different. You know, I have missed Frank a lot. Um, it's, we're going on eight years. In fact, next week will be the eight year anniversary of. I know. Um, so I am, I'm not acutely grieving. Like I was, that took about two years to go through my acute grief. Of course I still miss him. I can still remember him so well in my life that I had with him. But again, I attribute. The fact that I'm not in deep pain any longer, I'm very happy that I was able to grieve properly. Cause I do know people that get stuck and they kind of can't get over the hump because they just simply didn't grieve properly. Um, so yeah, it it's. It's a hard, it's just a hard time for so many. I, I, I'm a very empathetic person, so I hear stories and I see things about when I go to the grocery store, I just, my heart goes out to people very easily so I can carry things. But, um, it's been a very challenging year, but again, because I lean on my relationship with God, I'm able to. Get through it and release things to the Lord.

Erica 19:26

And it's so interesting for me to have seen the network you've accumulated with grief. I mean, I remember one time just sitting, I was sitting on my computer and you put a Facebook post and it just, it made such an impact on me cause it broke my heart and it was a man had written to you and he had lost his wife and he had felt connected to you. And he asked if there was something he could even do for his brain. To stop like the pain. I thought that was so sad. And I told my husband and he was like, that is so sad. Like, we were so sad for him because it makes sense why you would want to and why you would even ask somebody, do you know how to do that? And I mean, that's how bad it can feel

Gina Pastore 20:10

Yeah. Grief grief is very interesting because while I was going through it, as you know, it's kind of like a tidal wave of emotion is washing over you. And there's no way out. Um, but at the same time, I, there are things when I, when I look back and I, when I helping people go through grief, you do need a break from grief. Um, but I'm not talking about stuffing it or pretending it's not there, but you need to give yourself a reprieve. So for instance, I looked for when I was in my deepest grief, right after Frank died. Yeah. I really looked forward to going to bed at night and to go to sleep because that's a reprieve and I would often dream about Frank. So I kind of looked forward to it, but so allowing yourself to get rest and sleep and then having letting people in. I made a decision to let friends and family into my pain and they were grieving with me. So we would get to, you know, friends were coming over, bringing dinner, staying for dinner with me. I was letting that happen. Uh, people were spending the night for the first three months. My daughter, my son, my daughter-in-law people were spending the night with me. Um, and I was letting that I wasn't fighting it, you know? And we would, you know, at times maybe what, try to watch a movie. It was hard in the beginning for me to even do that, but I would try to give myself little breaks. And so, and then I would also give myself time to just cry and fill that pain. So there is kind of a, nobody teaches us to do this really. So, um, I enjoy helping people that may sound strange, but I realized that I can help people get through that. So, um, and just knowing other widows who went through it is encouraging God. That was another thing God did. He dropped in a widow into my life. We met through a mutual friend. She had gone through a tragic experience. She lost both her husband and her oldest son in a plane accident. And so I had heard about it years ago and I was able to meet her. We became friends and just, she was four years ahead of me. So she was through her deepest grief and just getting to know her and being around her minister to me, because I was like, okay, I'm watching someone who went through it. I know I'm going to get through what I'm going through. So there's a real blessing in that, you know?

Erica 22:57

Yeah, didn't didn't she? Ha are you allowed to say what ended up happening with her? Because I think I know how this, this went,

Gina Pastore 23:04

So a year, a couple years after Frank passed away, my daughter, Christina loses her mother-in-law Josh's mom passed away and her father-in-law of course went through a great time of grief. And about a year after. He decides he's ready to start. Dating men often will want a date sooner than women. Um, that's just a statistic. So anyways, my daughter. Shows him a picture of my friend, Debbie and says, this is my mom's friend, Debbie. And she lost her husband and another son and she's ready to start dating. And Ron says, okay, I would like to meet her. So they go on a date and basically they've been together ever since. And they are now married. So she is my in-laws. Now

Erica 23:59

you have so many funny things that happened to you. You

Gina Pastore 24:02

I know.

Erica 24:03

crazy things. I'm just like, Oh my gosh,

Gina Pastore 24:06

I'm telling you when you let God into your life and I'm not trying to be freaking, he went out, Oh, this woman, she's a born again, Christian. And she's got these crazy ideas, but I'm telling you, when you let into your life, you won't be surprised. The things that will happen, you will surprised.

Erica 24:24

Yeah. That's for sure.

Gina Pastore 24:26

Yes.

Erica 24:27

Well, Gina, I loved having you on thank you so much. And I, I hope that. I mean, there's no way to hear from somebody about grief, who hasn't walked through it, you know, for it to really mean something to you. I think you

Gina Pastore 24:41

That is true.

Erica 24:42

who went through it.

Gina Pastore 24:43

Yes.

Erica 24:44

So thank you so much for sharing everything. And I hope we can have you on again.

Gina Pastore 24:49

I would love that, Eric. And I'm so proud of you. I remember when you were starting out as your, uh, you would become the radio host the afternoon radio host at KC LA. And it's just so, so awesome to see what you are doing now and how you're helping others. And, and you have the cutest little baby boy, too.

Erica 25:10

thank you. He is cute. And he's a lot of work, but

Gina Pastore 25:13

Yes, he is.

Erica 25:14

cute. At least.

Gina Pastore 25:16

Yes. Well, thank you.

Erica 25:21

Thanks so much for tuning in today. I hope that something in today's conversation provided you with a feeling of hope, determination, or purpose. I know what you're going through, and that's why I want to give you some of the tools that helped me in my anxiety journey to get a free copy of free from fears head to freefromfearsbook.com to find out more about the CHAANGE anxiety treatment program. Find us at CHAANGE.com Thanks again for listening. And remember you are not broken You are not alone and you are on your way to living a life free of anxiety. See you next week.